conworlds.fun Forum Index conworlds.fun
A Community of Worldbuilders
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Inheriting land?

 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    conworlds.fun Forum Index -> World & Culture
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
eldin raigmore
Wizard
Wizard


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 723
Location: 1 SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Sun Jun 17, 2007 11:36 pm    Post subject: Inheriting land? Reply with quote

Eurasian system (land is owned and inheritable, and non-owners are not allowed to use it)?
Folklands (who inherits how much is governed by tradition)?
Booklands (who inherits how much is governed by a will and the law)?
The Seele-Teil (Soul-part) -- one-third of the land must be available to be bequeathed by will?
Only sons inherit unless there are no sons?
Only males inherit even if there are no sons?
Doweries, so that daughters who marry before the owner's death still get a piece?
Primogeniture -- Oldest son inherits everything?
Ultimogeniture -- Youngest son inherits everything?
Modern American system -- youngest daughter must remain unmarried and care for aged parents until they die, then she inherits the house and homestead and freehold?
Morning gifts -- wife inherits part of husband's' estate?
Limits to morning-gift -- can't, by law, be more than 25% of husband's net worth?
Stricter limits to morning-gift -- can't, by law, be more than 10% of husband's net worth?
If sons and unmarried daughters divide everything after parents' death, can married daughters join in the division provided they pitch in their dowries?
Is it a man's oldest sister's oldest son who inherits from him, rather than his wifes' oldest son?
Is all privately held real-estate held by women rather than by men?

.
.
.
etc.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
simon.clarkstone
Sorcerer
Sorcerer


Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 444
Location: Oxford, England

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

You forgot a system that covered a lot of land for many centuries (in Europe):

Commons: the land is owned by the community; since the community doesn't die, you don't need an inheritance system (for that land).

I think you mean "mourning", not "morning". The latter is a time of day, round here.
_________________
Creator of the Kigdatsi (explanatory thread coming in my copious free time).
Xhin wrote:
Mr. Saturday wrote:
OH, GOD SHIT JESUS.

A peculiar form of Theogenesis.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
eldin raigmore
Wizard
Wizard


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 723
Location: 1 SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2007 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

simon.clarkstone wrote:
You forgot a system that covered a lot of land for many centuries (in Europe):
Commons: the land is owned by the community; since the community doesn't die, you don't need an inheritance system (for that land).
That's pretty much the non-Eurasian system. It was the usual system most places outside of Europe and Asia until Europeans and Asians began to settle other continents.
Commons are usually a type of folklands (if they're commons because "everybody knows they're commons"), though they may be booklands (if they're commons because of a decree or legislative act or some such); however not much need be said about them since, as you said, they won't be inherited.
And, yes, even in Eurasia, there were some lands that were commons, even when most were booklands or folklands. But I think if people have a lot of interesting stuff to say, more of it will be said about the inheritable private real property, than about the commons.

simon.clarkstone wrote:
]I think you mean "mourning", not "morning". The latter is a time of day, round here.
No, I meant "morning", as in "morning after", as in "morning after the wedding night"; I think it's related to "morganitic", but I don't think they went obligatorily hand-in-hand.* I've never heard it referred to as a "mourning gift"; if you have, where and in what context? It's probably relevant to the topic I was trying to introduce.

Thanks.

*In a "morganitic marriage" ("marriage with morning gift"), the children would inherit the class and rank and degree of the lower-ranking spouse rather than of the higher-ranking spouse; so if a crown prince married a baroness, say, and someone with the authority to do so declared the marriage "morganitic", any children from that marriage would be baronial rather than royal.
But I don't think the giving of a morning-gift automatically made the marriage morganitic.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
eldin raigmore
Wizard
Wizard


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 723
Location: 1 SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Tue Jun 19, 2007 12:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

simon.clarkstone wrote:
I think you mean "mourning", not "morning".
For "mourning gifts", see http://www.cartoonstock.com/directory/m/mourning_gifts.asp.

More seriously, also see http://coe.asafas.kyoto-u.ac.jp/research/sea/social/hayashi/Hayashi_Unnan_4He.htm.

For "morning gift", see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dower. Apparently, if this is to be trusted, it was usually given at the wedding, but was usually used mostly during widowhood; perhaps that's the source of the confusion. (Assuming the similarity in pronunciation and spelling between "morning" and "mourning" isn't the only source.)

Less seriously, also see http://www.cartoonstock.com/vintage/directory/m/morning_gifts.asp.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
fmra
Apprentice
Apprentice


Joined: 17 Jan 2007
Posts: 57

PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2007 8:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Equal-field system: Government owns all land and assigns plots to every person. No inheritance, the government just reassigns the land to someone else.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
sintau.tayua
Newcomer


Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 21
Location: New Zealand (rocks!)

PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 5:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

My main culture at the moment, the Psinu, is ocean-nomadic: they live on rafts, often in transient and ever-changing cities. This means that there is not land to inherit.
The rafts, however, have to be divided up.
First, a note about these rafts: Each raft is typically quite small, because larger rafts cannot handle the waves of ocean waves. Each ocean town/city usually has a fair share of large rafts; their existence is made possible because the civilian rafts absorb most of the waves. For the same reason, rich people tend to live in the center of the town, while lower-class families live on the edge.
At the same time, even the larger rafts in the town are made from many small interlocking rafts, because if there is a storm, they need to be able to break up and spread out (to avoid being slammed together)

Anyway, the point of this ramble is that Psinu homes are made for a lot of small rafts, not one big raft. This makes inheritance a lot easier (two rafts for you, two for you . . .)
These rafts are not all used for the same purpose, however. These are the common raft-forms:
1. The house raft. The house raft is the only 'owned' raft; all the others belong to the family group (more on that later). An adolescent is given their house raft (equivalent to their bedroom) at thirteen. The building of the raft is undertaken by the caregiver (father or uncle) and the son or daughter who will receive it. Often, in richer families, the daughter will merely design the raft, and the father will build it. House rafts are never bought ready-made, although other rafts can be.
Anyway. The child lives in this raft all his life, repairing it when needed. When he or she is married, the couple sleep on one raft, and the children sleep on other raft. When he or she dies, they are buried/sunk on a raft. Usually it is their own raft. However, if they still have children who do not have their raft yet (very rare), they are sunk on a family-group-owned raft. Also, if they are poor, they may be sunk on a simple raft bought cheaply for the occasion.

2. The Water raft. This consists of a solar still or another water-purification system sitting on a raft. Purified water is poured into sealed containers and tied to the raft. As fresh water is lighter than salt water, and so floats, a huge amount of purified water can be stored from one raft.
There is usually one water raft for every family group. When a person starts a new family group, they build or buy their own water raft. Otherwise, the raft is the communal property of the family-group, and as such is not inherited.

3. The food rafts. Rafts growing seaweeds or other foods. These are the property . . . .

[I have to get of the computer; will finish/polish later]
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
eldin raigmore
Wizard
Wizard


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 723
Location: 1 SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Tue Jul 03, 2007 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

simon.clarkstone wrote:
Commons: the land is owned by the community; since the community doesn't die, you don't need an inheritance system (for that land).

Thanks, simon.
fmra wrote:
Equal-field system: Government owns all land and assigns plots to every person. No inheritance, the government just reassigns the land to someone else.

Thanks, fmra.
Isn't that a booklandish version of simon.clarkstone's "Commons"?
It's an interesting fact, but in the abstract it's hard to come up with any interesting details to elaborate it; the interesting details will come up when a particular person is reassigned a particular piece of land that used to be assigned to a particular different person. (Or, a particular person is reassigned to a particular piece of land when they used to be assigned to a particular other piece of land.)

sintau.tayua wrote:
My main culture at the moment, the Psinu, is ocean-nomadic: they live on rafts, often in transient and ever-changing cities. This means that there is not land to inherit.
The rafts, however, have to be divided up.
Thanks, sintau.tayua. This looks interesting. I'll be interested in seeing the rest; I believe the rest of us will be interested too.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Rin
Conjurer
Conjurer


Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2007 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All Aerien houses are built to house four people. A house may hold a couple and two children, a couple a sibling and a child, just a couple, or just two siblings.
How many children an Aerien may have is regulated by the government. They are allowed to have two, maximum. If they choose not to have any children, then they report it and their land will be given to someone else upon their death by the government. If someone wants to have more than two children, then they also report it to the government and have to wait until they get someone elses space in which they can raise the other children they want to have.
If a couple has two children, like they are supposed to, then one of those children is expected to stay in the family building with their mate and one of those is supposed to move into their mates family building.
Aerien's are very patient and their inheritance system is independent of gender.

Did that make sense? Sad
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
eldin raigmore
Wizard
Wizard


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 723
Location: 1 SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Wed Jul 11, 2007 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rin wrote:
... How many children an Aerien may have is regulated by the government. They are allowed to have two, maximum. ... Did that make sense? Sad
No; if the maximum is two, the mean will be less than two, which will be less than the replacement rate. Instead the birthrate should be regulated so that it's about equal to the deathrate. The mean number of children per couple per lifetime should be close to two. That means the maximum needs to be more than two; perhaps the government can select outstanding couples to have a third child, at least in those years when the birthrate has fallen behind the deathrate.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Rin
Conjurer
Conjurer


Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 4:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The process works like this: if you want to have less than two children, you report it. If you want to have more than two kids, you report it.
So say Mr. and Mrs. Arelin don't want to have any kids. They tell the office of Population. The official records it. He writes down the couples name and the fact that there are now two empty spots.
After Mr. and Mrs. Arelin leave, Mr. and Mrs. Lavindai came in. They want to have more than two kids : to be exact, they want to have four. The official assigns them to Mr. and Mrs. Arelin. The spots have now been taken up. The Lavindai's will be allowed to build an extension on their house to accomedate their children.
The reason for all of this is that land is a precious commodity in the cities: there is enough that it can support the present population and NO MORE.
So population is closely monitored.
( As for why the population restrictions don't breed mass disobedience: the government is closely tied to the clergy which is closely tied to the military... you can guess how it works. )
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
Contrail
Newcomer


Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In Fegraemble, the country I've most developed for my conworld Klounal-Ampae, land and businesses belong to families, and pass to a chosen heir, which is decided by the amount of interest and ability the family's children have shown in the running of the business/farm/etc. and not on gender or birth order, although children born earlier tend to have an advantage over their younger siblings, because if an older child seems to be a good candidate for heir, the younger child has to be significantly better and more interested than the older one for the parents to change their mind about who should be the heir.

The children not chosen as heir generally take one of three routes: 1) they marry someone who is another family's heir, becoming part of that family, 2) they stay within their sibling's household, help with keeping the business running, taking care of children, etc. and usually remain unmarried, or 3) they strike out on their own and attempt to establish a new family/business.

A major factor in the perpetuation of this system is that many professions are biased towards people who can magically control a particular element, and which element a person can influence is genetically determined. So someone's children usually already have one of the necessary qualifications to be good at that person's profession, the ability to control the element associated with the profession.

- Contrail
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
eldin raigmore
Wizard
Wizard


Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 723
Location: 1 SouthEast Michigan

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Rin wrote:
The process works like this: if you want to have less than two children, you report it. If you want to have more than two kids, you report it.
So say Mr. and Mrs. Arelin don't want to have any kids. They tell the office of Population. The official records it. He writes down the couples name and the fact that there are now two empty spots.
After Mr. and Mrs. Arelin leave, Mr. and Mrs. Lavindai came in. They want to have more than two kids : to be exact, they want to have four. The official assigns them to Mr. and Mrs. Arelin. The spots have now been taken up. The Lavindai's will be allowed to build an extension on their house to accomedate their children.
The reason for all of this is that land is a precious commodity in the cities: there is enough that it can support the present population and NO MORE.
So population is closely monitored.
( As for why the population restrictions don't breed mass disobedience: the government is closely tied to the clergy which is closely tied to the military... you can guess how it works. )

That'll work fine.
As long as the average number of children per couple per lifetime is exactly two the population will remain constant.
If this average were less than two -- say, 1.95 or something -- the population would decline, which would be a problem.
(Of course if the average is more than two -- say, 2.01 or so -- the population will grow, which you've already said would also be a problem.)

My point was, if the max is two but the min is less than two (and you said
it could be zero), then the average would have to be less than two, which would lead to a declining population.
Your new post makes it clear the max is more than two; in rare and exceptional circumstances a couple may have three, or even four, children; the number of couples who have three or four balances those who have one or none.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
simon.clarkstone
Sorcerer
Sorcerer


Joined: 17 Dec 2006
Posts: 444
Location: Oxford, England

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 8:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Contrail wrote:
In Fegraemble, the country I've most developed for my conworld Klounal-Ampae, land and businesses belong to families, and pass to a chosen heir, which is decided by the amount of interest and ability the family's children have shown in the running of the business/farm/etc. and not on gender or birth order, although children born earlier tend to have an advantage over their younger siblings, because if an older child seems to be a good candidate for heir, the younger child has to be significantly better and more interested than the older one for the parents to change their mind about who should be the heir.

Does this often cause resentment among those who think they were wrongly not chosen?
_________________
Creator of the Kigdatsi (explanatory thread coming in my copious free time).
Xhin wrote:
Mr. Saturday wrote:
OH, GOD SHIT JESUS.

A peculiar form of Theogenesis.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website MSN Messenger
Contrail
Newcomer


Joined: 25 Jun 2007
Posts: 7
Location: Austin, TX

PostPosted: Thu Jul 12, 2007 10:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

simon.clarkstone wrote:
Contrail wrote:
In Fegraemble, the country I've most developed for my conworld Klounal-Ampae, land and businesses belong to families, and pass to a chosen heir, which is decided by the amount of interest and ability the family's children have shown in the running of the business/farm/etc. and not on gender or birth order, although children born earlier tend to have an advantage over their younger siblings, because if an older child seems to be a good candidate for heir, the younger child has to be significantly better and more interested than the older one for the parents to change their mind about who should be the heir.

Does this often cause resentment among those who think they were wrongly not chosen?


It certainly can, particularly if the choice was between two children close in both age and ability or interest or if an older child who was going to be the heir is supplanted by a more talented younger sibling. When the age gap is larger, the younger child or children often expect not to be chosen if the parents have already settled on the oldest as a good heir. The parents do usually try to help their other children find a way to make a good life for themselves as well, by doing things like providing initial financial support for a new business, arranging for an apprenticeship if the child wants to pursue a different profession, finding good marriage candidates, etc.

Also, marrying another family's heir isn't really seen as being a significantly lesser fate/position, because a person's spouse is expected to work as an important partner with that person as part of that family's business. If someone plays their cards right, it's possible for them to marry into a larger/more prosperous business of the same type and ultimately end up better off than if they had become the heir of their own family. So inheriting the family's business isn't the end-all and be-all of success.

- Contrail
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Rin
Conjurer
Conjurer


Joined: 24 Jun 2007
Posts: 160

PostPosted: Fri Jul 13, 2007 11:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry, I should have said two is the maximum unless you petition the government.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I started this thread and I have yet to answer it! I'll try to come up with something the week of 8 Jan 2018.
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chiarizio wrote:
I started this thread and I have yet to answer it! I'll try to come up with something the week of 8 Jan 2018.


In Adpihi, or at least early Adpihi, real estate is mostly owned by females, and inherited from mother to daughter. Whether this is female primogeniture (oldest daughter inherits all land unless there are no daughters), female ultimogeniture (youngest daughter inherits all land unless there are no daughters), or all daughters inherit equally, depends on place and time.

Early on, all-daughters-inherit-equally won't be considered a good idea.

Portable possessions, OTOH, are mostly owned by males, and mostly inherited father-to-son, at least early on. Again, this may be male primogeniture, or male ultimogeniture, or all-sons-share-equally, depending on place and tiime.
Although all-sons-inherit-equally will be the least common and least popular of these three systems, it will be more common than the all-daughters-inherit-equally system for real estate.

Intangible/invisible possessions will mostly be inherited by a child of the opposite sex, if there is one. Again, whether by the youngest, or by the oldest, or by all, varies by time and place; and also by kind of property. Some property will be regarded as indivisible, and only one child can inherit it; other property may be regarded as divisible, and more than one child can inherit it simultaneously. Perhaps, though, sometimes, it can have limited divisibility, and can be inherited by at most two children.

What to do if there are no surviving offspring of the appropriate sex, may vary with time and place as well. Early on, for instance, if real-estate is inherited by female primogeniture, then if the decessor has no surviving daughters nor daughters of daughters etc., her mother's oldest surviving daughter (probably her oldest living sister) will inherit; or if that sister is deceased as well, but has a surviving daughter, the oldest such surviving niece will inherit.

But as time goes on, more and more will things be handled according to the will of the deceased. This will apply both to real-estate and portable goods. Some intangible property (for instance, copyrights etc.) will also be handled like that; OTOH some (for instance, political offices) will be handled the way the government wants it handled, regardless of the will of the decedent.

Also, more and more of the land will be "booklands" as opposed to "folklands".
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 4:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Would it be rude of me to bump this?
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bloodb4roses
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 16 Dec 2006
Posts: 2007
Location: Off on the side

PostPosted: Wed Aug 15, 2018 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I should think about this but I'm a bit tired and it's a little late.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Mon Sep 03, 2018 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bloodb4roses wrote:
I should think about this but I'm a bit tired and it's a little late.

Well, if you ever feel like posting some thoughts, at least several of us will be interested.
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
elemtilas
Conjurer
Conjurer


Joined: 04 Nov 2014
Posts: 201
Location: Never anywhere but here!

PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

eldin raigmore wrote:
Rin wrote:
The process works like this: if you want to have less than two children, you report it. If you want to have more than two kids, you report it.
So say Mr. and Mrs. Arelin don't want to have any kids. They tell the office of Population. The official records it. He writes down the couples name and the fact that there are now two empty spots.
After Mr. and Mrs. Arelin leave, Mr. and Mrs. Lavindai came in. They want to have more than two kids : to be exact, they want to have four. The official assigns them to Mr. and Mrs. Arelin. The spots have now been taken up. The Lavindai's will be allowed to build an extension on their house to accomedate their children.
The reason for all of this is that land is a precious commodity in the cities: there is enough that it can support the present population and NO MORE.
So population is closely monitored.
( As for why the population restrictions don't breed mass disobedience: the government is closely tied to the clergy which is closely tied to the military... you can guess how it works. )


That'll work fine.
As long as the average number of children per couple per lifetime is exactly two the population will remain constant.
If this average were less than two -- say, 1.95 or something -- the population would decline, which would be a problem.
(Of course if the average is more than two -- say, 2.01 or so -- the population will grow, which you've already said would also be a problem.)

My point was, if the max is two but the min is less than two (and you said
it could be zero), then the average would have to be less than two, which would lead to a declining population.
Your new post makes it clear the max is more than two; in rare and exceptional circumstances a couple may have three, or even four, children; the number of couples who have three or four balances those who have one or none.


The only hitch I see here is that, at some point in time, perhaps by lottery?, a number of couples will have to be given the right / given orders to make some extra children in order to make up for inevitable accidents, death by disease, murder, etc.

The lottery doesn't have to be held every year. The officials monitoring population statistics could let the real population number slide by some thousands before they'd have to do anything corrective. Maybe every four years or something.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Foolster41
Conjurer
Conjurer


Joined: 15 Sep 2009
Posts: 272
Location: Pacific Northwest, USA

PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 2:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I feel like I need to come up with a system for this for Saltha since I imagine land would be fairly scarce in a country where arable land is grouped around oasis cities.

I want them to have some form of farming since I want them to have access to grain to make bread for some of their recipes.

Maybe there's a regulated farming caste/guild because a lack of grain by mismanagement could be pretty disastrous to them.

I'm not sure what implications this would have for the economic system.


One thought I had was rich Salthans are polygamous, with multiple houses each with the separate wives and children. Obviously feeding/providing for the wives and children would cost more, but would mean more of their clan/family name being spread. I imagine this would affect too how land inheritance works.

Again, I'm not sure the implications of such as a system, or if it would work in any stable way.
_________________
"You don't have a soul, you are a soul. You have a body." - C. S. Lewis
The Bikaesh Foundaiton
Lawful Neutral
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Visit poster's website
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Wed Sep 05, 2018 4:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@elemtilas; interesting points!
@Foolster41; interesting problems!
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

bloodb4roses wrote:
I should think about this but I'm a bit tired and it's a little late.


How ‘bout now? Mr. Green
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bloodb4roses
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 16 Dec 2006
Posts: 2007
Location: Off on the side

PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

chiarizio wrote:
bloodb4roses wrote:
I should think about this but I'm a bit tired and it's a little late.


How ‘bout now? Mr. Green


I've thought a little about it for my cats and could probably come up with something for my danpyr. But it might have to wait until after the holidays. Or at least Christmas.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Sun Dec 23, 2018 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, may you have safe, healthy, happy, restful, and merry holidays, into the upcoming new year!
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
bloodb4roses
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 16 Dec 2006
Posts: 2007
Location: Off on the side

PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Getting back to this, for kaibyou, a "family" and a "clan" are almost indistinguishable, although a few cats considering themselves as siblings and looking out for each other might not consider themselves a clan at all. When it come to how territories are kept and passed on, they work similarly enough.

In any group of cats, there isn't a strict "pecking order" but there is generally one or a few cats who are the most well-liked, or feared, or respected and if there are more than one in a group, the leader is either one of these cats, or a cat with close bonds to most of these cats. In a small family, it might be the oldest sibling, and in a larger clan it might be the cat that started the clan, or a successor once that cat has died or retired.

A family or clan can only hold territory that it can effectively defend. Sometimes clans will allow smaller family groups on their borders just because the smaller families won't do much to cause trouble and the territory the smaller families take up can act as a buffer zone or might just be less desirable to larger clans for whatever reason.

However, the territory a clan or family owns belongs to all members of said clan/family. They might split it up further among themselves but more often, the territory is used communally. Humans have assumed mundane cats are non-social by default, but house cats at least are "semi-social" creatures as opposed to their truly solitary wildcat cousins. Likewise, kaibyou are actually fairly social beings among their own kind and sometimes even make friends with humans and other youkai. Clans often work very well amongst themselves when it comes to deciding what must be done for the benefit of the clan.

So, as long as there's enough room and hunting ground for all members, or places that can be expanded to either by the clan itself or by some of the clan going off to another place, things work out well. Spoils from hunts, and even business endeavors, are shared through the clan or kept in trust for use later. Since they mostly only need to care for themselves in cat form unless they wish otherwise, they take up less resources than they might otherwise and a small patch of city or a large farm is more than enough to provide for even large clans.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
chiarizio
Planewalker
Planewalker


Joined: 23 Jun 2007
Posts: 2000
Location: Bungula Qintaurion, Toliman

PostPosted: Wed Jan 16, 2019 6:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I discovered lately that there were sometimes other variations on the morning-gift.

“With all my worldly goods I thee endow” was inserted into the wedding vows by the church to make the morning-gift be at least everything the groom owned.

Sometimes the morning-gift was made by the groom’s father rather than the groom himself.

It was kind of like a life-insurance policy on the groom’s life, with the bride as the beneficiary.

Some secular jurisdictions required the morning-gift to be equal to at least half the groom’s net worth. Some prohibited it from being more than half.

Some secular jurisdictions required the morning-gift to be equal to at least a third of the groom’s net worth. Some prohibited it from being more than a third.

Some secular jurisdictions required the morning-gift to be equal to at least a quarter of the groom’s net worth. Some prohibited it from being more than a quarter.

Some secular jurisdictions required the morning-gift to be equal to at least a tenth of the groom’s net worth. Some prohibited it from being more than a tenth.

If a widow had children she could, and often did, bequeath or give her morning-gift, or parts of it, to her children.

If a widow remarried, she could contribute her morning-gift from her deceased husband, into the total marital wealth of the new couple consisting of her and her new husband.
_________________
"We're the healthiest horse in the glue factory" - Erskine Bowles, Co-Chairman of the deficit reduction commission
-----------------------------
I am also eldin raigmore.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    conworlds.fun Forum Index -> World & Culture All times are GMT + 2 Hours
Page 1 of 1

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group